79261-123148

OT: To David Black
79261 [mccramer@s. ] Sorry listies for this totally oftopic post, but I have no other chance...
79262 [B.Candler@po] Actually you do...

ruby's regexp: Is there no opposite of =~ ???
79263 [mccramer@s. ] Searching through "Programming Ruby" I found the Perl-like "=~" for
+ 79264 [B.Candler@po] Yes... it's !~   :-)
+ 79265 [batsman.geo@] batsman@tux-chan:/tmp$ ruby

WeBrick,mod_ruby
79270 [dcorbin@ma h] It appears as if WeBrick  has become the standard for a "servlet model" of web

Îòäû? ? ñî÷è   pxNEeAvbai
79271 [sanatory@e- ] ...

[REMINDER] RubyConf 2003: Call for Presentation Proposals
79275 [chadfowler@c] quickly.  In order to help us plan the event, please get your

CGI:Session and security
79276 [volker_grabs] There are some simple standard problems which crowd my brain :-)
80822 [volker_grabs] ... MMh, and no answer yet.
80827 [cjeker@di ha] Have you ever tried it? Makeing a hidden form field form a session is not
80828 [fxn@ha hr f.] Just for the record, %Q makes that kind of stuff more readable and less error

[ANN] Raggle 0.2.0
79277 [pabs@pa lo r] Earlier this afternoon I posted version 0.2.0 of Raggle.  Raggle is a

gsubbing ' to \'
79279 [kdresner@cs ] I was trying to escape some apostrophes with gsub.  The only way I could
79287 [djd15@po cw ] ...

Wish: Python-style indenting
79280 [Jon_Aquino@s] I wish Ruby had Python's use of whitespace to indicate blocks. Then I
+ 79281 [dcarrera@ma ] I rather prefer having a clear delimiter like "end".  I don't like
| + 79282 [aredridel@nb] array.map do |e|
| | 79290 [gsinclair@so] Pythonistas would see that as bad style anyway.
| | 79295 [piman@sa re ] Yes, because ["foo" + e + "foo" for e in array] is much more readable,
| + 79288 [tim@ve et .a] for item in iterator: some(statements); separated; by(semicolons)
+ 79284 [lone-star@ho] I wish Pythan had Ruby's use of delimiters to indicate blocks. Then I
+ 79299 [matz@ru y- a] You are free to wish, but the change makes Ruby no longer Ruby. ;-)
| 79384 [Jon_Aquino@s] We could call it PyRuby ;-) The best of both worlds.
| 79933 [frank.schmit] How about Pyby? Or Ruthon? :-)
| 79935 [martindemell] Coralsnake (http://www.santarosa.edu/lifesciences/coralsn1.gif)
| 80004 [Jon_Aquino@s] Hey, I think there's starting to be some serious interest here in
| 80009 [martindemell] Parrot should cut that particular Gordian knot, no? I think the ideal
+ 79317 [mmirra@li er] Check the archives through Google or www.ruby-talk.org.  IIRC, an
| 79320 [fxn@ha hr f.] ...
+ 80809 [greg@pu o. j] I can happily say after tutoring a 3rd year university Python course and
  80811 [dcarrera@ma ] Thank you for that post.  This is a good thing to know.  I also teach at

Bug when rerouting String#gsub with a block using $1?
79283 [flgr@cc n. e] Moin!
79286 [batsman.geo@] batsman@tux-chan:/tmp$ expand -t2 a.rb
79300 [matz@ru y- a] Explicitly?  You can pass the match data and assign it to $~.
79303 [batsman.geo@] But this doesn't solve the problem, does it?
79304 [matz@ru y- a] In pure Ruby, yes.
+ 79305 [batsman.geo@] ouch. We'll then need C to make real Junctions then (not so bad since
+ 79308 [djd15@po cw ] p "hello world".gsub(/(\w+)/) { puts $1; $1 }
+ 79323 [nobu.nokada@] You forget the trick that you'd written ago.
+ 79348 [flgr@cc n. e] Moin!
  79371 [matz@ru y- a] Then don't use ugly dollar variables.  But perhaps gsub should have
  79379 [flgr@cc n. e] Moin!

Ruby for 3D graphics?
79292 [vanevery@3D ] Ok, I'm sick to death of C++.  I'm moving on to a higher level language of
79293 [wjl@ic ca er] charset="iso-8859-1"
79411 [vanevery@3D ] Wesley, I saw only a blank where you tried to reply.
79442 [hal9000@hy e] He replied, but if you're using Outlook Express,
79448 [jason@jv eg ] I'd recommend the Mozilla mail client, as it will be familiar to OE
+ 79449 [markjreed@ma] Thunderbird is also worth a look - it's Mozilla's standalone mail/news
+ 79465 [rasputin@id ] yup :)
+ 79722 [dagbrown@LA ] No way!  Mutt isn't hard-core enough for the TRUE hard-core
  79728 [emschwar@po ] mh?  Bloody MUAs, always bloating & adding features you don't need.
  79852 [ jupp@gm .d ] Saluton!
  79864 [emschwar@po ] Right, next time I'll obviously have to use explicit <sarcasm /> tags.

Quick self-intro/comment
79296 [dhtapp@co .n] Just a quick mooch of the group's bandwidth to say how much I'm enjoying it

Quick self-intro/comment II (WebObjects)
79297 [dhtapp@co .n] Oops, I meant to include this in the other message:  While browsing the
+ 79298 [gsinclair@so] It is my flawed understanding that CGIKit is based on Apple WebObjects.  A
+ 79318 [chadfowler@c] I know Gavin already answered, but I think the answer you're looking for
  79325 [gsinclair@so] Funny, IOWA makes no mention of WebObjects in any of the docs I looked
  79382 [avi@be a4 co] The design of IOWA was indeed heavily inspired by WebObjects; it's
  79393 [dhtapp@co .n] Thanks; duly noted.

uninitialized constant Myclass (NameError)
79302 [dali@in ul .] require 'Mymodule'
+ 79310 [batsman.geo@] This includes Mymodule in Object (and hence in every Ruby object), are
+ 79312 [decoux@mo lo] There is an inconsistance between rb_const_defined_at() and
  + 79314 [dali@in ul .] This is interesting question. In fact I experienced the error in one of my
  + 79405 [matz@ru y- a] It must be a bug.  I will fix when I finish the job at hand.
  + 79443 [nobu.nokada@] Do you mean this?
    79446 [decoux@mo lo] Not really this  (I've added comment in the source :-)))
    + 79474 [nobu.nokada@] Hmmm.
    + 80418 [matz@ru y- a] I think I fixed the problem.  See the latest CVS.

Tk: non-default font 16 x slower
79315 [wybo@se va y] When I use the default fonts in my Ruby-Tk application it takes
+ 79358 [nagai@ai ky ] Could you tell me your environment ( Ruby version, Tcl/Tk version, OS,
+ 79386 [kero@ch ll .] Use a font explicitely, not only string references (which causes the font
| 79422 [rz@li ux m6 ] very good tip, but why is font creation so exceedingly slow
| + 79440 [nagai@ai ky ] Ruby/Tk recommends to distinguish between (1) widgets have the
| + 79445 [kero@ch ll .] It is "created" in Tk. Probably some "extra" things happen.
+ 80954 [nagai@ai ky ] I improved font control of Ruby/Tk on CVS. Probably, it has better

Ruby-GNOME2 website in French
79316 [laurent@da a] <French>

Question: immutable strings as design goal?
79319 [gsinclair@so] -talkers,
+ 79333 [matz@ru y- a] If mutable strings are horror, mutable dictionaries should be as well.
| + 79337 [feldt@ce ch ] I agree that it sounds like a very ad hoc design decision.
| | + 79340 [gedb01@ya oo] Am I correct in thinking that as long as you avoid the
| | | + 79343 [feldt@ce ch ] Not really, see []= in my example code.
| | | | 79345 [gsinclair@so] String#concat is another popular trap for young players.
| | | | 79353 [djd15@po cw ] That's a weird one.  I would probably expect there to be String#concat
| | | + 79346 [dan@ta ta od] In his excellent book Effective Java, Josh Bloch talks a lot about the
| | + 79344 [matz@ru y- a] Yes.  It's a language for smart wannabe (i.e people trying to be
| | | 79354 [chr_news@gm ] Thanks,
| | + 79362 [hanzspam@ya ] This is not the reason Python's strings are immutable,
| |   + 79365 [feldt@ce ch ] Hannu Kankaanpää <hanzspam@yahoo.com.au> skrev den Tue, 19 Aug 2003
| |   + 79373 [mwilson13@co] I'll refer to Objective C/Cocoa in this context again. In addition to
| |   + 79376 [Dave@Pr gP o] Ruby gets around this by dup-ing strings used as Hash keys, so the
| |   | 79378 [pbrannan@at ] dup-ing and freezing.  It would still be possible to modify the Hash key
| |   | + 79380 [mwilson13@co] I think the point is that you would have to expressly access the Hash
| |   | + 79381 [Dave@Pr gP o] Indeed, although there's nothing intrinsically wrong with modifying a
| |   + 79383 [  amk@am .c ] Mutable strings also result in a more complicated implementation. One of
| |   | 79387 [mwilson13@co] I think this is part of Ruby's overall philosophy -- the focus is on
| |   + 79397 [gsinclair@so] That may be the case, but such a pragmatic, agnostic consideration
| |     + 79400 [mwilson13@co] While we're still on the subject of Python and Guido Von Rossum's blog
| |     | + 79410 [markjreed@ma] Wow!  What an amazing feature!  How could Guido have
| |     | + 79413 [gsinclair@so] Yeah, and it's funny how he remarks about other languages allegedly
| |     | | 79424 [  amk@am .c ] Er, that's because CLU and Icon *were* the inspiration for Python's
| |     | | + 79425 [gsinclair@so] You misunderstand me.  I wasn't suggesting that Python or Ruby have
| |     | | + 79456 [hal9000@hy e] describing
| |     | + 79421 [dan@si he or] Hey, it could have been worse--you could have been sitting between
| |     | | 79438 [matz@ru y- a] Yep.  And it's indeed a great step in Python.
| |     | | 79441 [martindemell] LOL!!!! So true, so true.
| |     | + 79455 [hal9000@hy e] eyes.roll
| |     |   79496 [matz@ru y- a] There's enumerate().
| |     |   79500 [markjreed@ma] Hm.  Must be new in 2.3?
| |     |   79691 [dagbrown@LA ] Yuppers.
| |     + 79406 [dan@si he or] That's just Guido being Guido. I wouldn't particularly read too much
| + 79339 [gsinclair@so] Yes, that thought struck me as well.
| | + 79342 [matz@ru y- a] I know, I know.  Don't take my words seriously.
| | + 79357 [rpav@us rs s] There are always performance issues to consider as well.  Constantly
| |   79363 [mwilson13@co] I'm no matz or Guido (no surprise there), but I would point out that
| |   79366 [dan@si he or] Many of the Cocoa core foundation classes have mutable and immutable
| + 79367 [lone-star@ho] I'm sorry, but I can't see what the problem/horror is.  Can someone
+ 79364 [lucsky@ma .c] No it's not. Guido is just insanely jealous that Matz' personal hero is
  79368 [lone-star@ho] Haha!  Yeah, that's probably the reason ;-)
  79370 [Patrick.Benn] I'm surprised you didn't mention his summing up of Ruby as "cute."

FROM MARYAM
79321 [maryamabacha] Dear Friend,

@@newimpl and @newimpl in Net
79322 [gedb01@ya oo] Just getting to the bottom of my Net:HTTP problems,
79324 [armin@xs .d ] The big difference is that all instances of one class
+ 79326 [dblack@su er] ... and all instances of all descendant classes of that class.
+ 79327 [gedb01@ya oo] So @implVersion is an entirely different variable to
  + 79329 [decoux@mo lo] This is this case
  | 79336 [gedb01@ya oo] Thanks all for your patience.
  + 79334 [dblack@su er] Do you mean @newimpl?

Python indentation for Ruby under Emacs
79328 [fxn@ha hr f.] If instead of hiding "end"s using a special font, which anyway leaves
+ 79361 [mwilson13@co] While I am gratified that Ruby will never use indentation as Python
| 79369 [fxn@ha hr f.] But that's not the standard layout, and the "; end"s are there anyway.
+ 80094 [fxn@ha hr f.] There was a typo in the regexp. I send the correction to the list just

adding methods to a C++ class in 1.8.0 - has anything changed?
79330 [james@la ya ] I'm currently writing a tool where the data-structure is coded in C++,
79335 [decoux@mo lo] see [ruby-talk:79302], [ruby-talk:79312]

make install  problem 1.8
79347 [rodrigo.berm] I'am installing ruby 1.8 on HPUX(the harder one!!)..and
79350 [nobu.nokada@] To where did you extract the source?  /opt/ruby-1.8.0?
79351 [rodrigo.berm] Yes .
79352 [nobu.nokada@] And you seem to try installing to the same place.  So installer

FOREIGN PARTNER NEEDED
79349 [ericnkomo@ne] ...

Ruby-talk, ?-?o÷òoâûe paccûëêè
79372 [_aix_close@h] X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by funfun.nagaokaut.ac.jp id h7II6ix08892

Distributing a application
79374 [andre@sy po ] I'm thinking about distributing a application (a game, to be more
+ 79375 [dcarrera@ma ] I've been thinking a lot about this myself.  This is the best I've come up
+ 79377 [chrismo@cl b] Chris
+ 79398 [jean-francoi] yes, I have the same problem. I try to use only the features that are
+ 79692 [dagbrown@LA ] Check out "rbconfig" and "ftools".  "rbconfig" to tell you about
+ 79744 [pan@er kv en] Have a look at Tar2RubyScript. You have to distribute Ruby

warning from ruby-pam using 1.8.0
79385 [samuel@al en] I patched ruby-pam so that it wouldn't give me warnings about the
79390 [samuel@al en] A little investigation yielded the answer.  It was a matter of

Ruby Tk documentation translation
79388 [mwilson13@co] Koji Arai put together a Ruby Tk manual in Japanese. This manual looks

Assembling MIME message
79392 [dcorbin@ma h] Is there a Ruby library that makes it easy to correctly build a standard email

[ANN] Tar2RubyScript
79394 [pan@er kv en] I'm pleased to announce the birth of Tar2RubyScript.
+ 79395 [dcarrera@ma ] That is really cool!
+ 79402 [mgarriss@ea ] Excellent work!  I definitely can make use of this.
+ 79764 [google@er kv] Version 0.1.1 is now available. A little bug concerning file

While we're talking Smalltalk
79396 [ben@th ng ag] Now I know, this is the *ruby*-talk group, but since we're talking about

[ANN] The wxRuby Project has moved to RubyForge
79399 [curt@hi bs c] We've Moved!

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79403 [shop@ja e. o] ¨¬¨³¨¬¨¬¨¬¨¬¨¬¨¬¨¬¨¬¨¬¨¬¨¬¨¬¨¬¨¬¨¬¨¬¨¬¨¬¨¬¨¬¨¬¨¬¨¬¨¬¨¬¨¬¨¬¨¬¨¬¨¬¨¬¨¬¨¬¨¬¨¬¨¬

DBI module weirdness
79404 [kdresner@cs ] I am trying to do the following with a PostgreSQL database.
79544 [mneumann@nt ] Please try version 0.0.20.

How to open a file in windows
79407 [beanie@gr ph] I am trying to offer a way to play audio files from my ruby program (by
+ 79408 [hal9000@hy e] app to
| 79409 [djd15@po cw ] `start <filename>`
| 79416 [niklas@ka i.] module Win32
+ 79469 [bdelmee@ad a] Suggestions to use "start" are correct but I think they'll
  79473 [bdelmee@ad a] I had never used Win32API myself, which is why I

Why did you switch from Python to Ruby?
79412 [vanevery@3D ] This question is only meant to apply to people who used to use Python, but
+ 79417 [gedb01@ya oo] Brandon,
| 79703 [hanzspam@ya ] Seems like you forgot inheritance, metaclasses, polymorphism
+ 79418 [maillist@be ] I got sick of indents, its a pain when copying and pasting code... but
+ 79419 [wew@wi li mw] Closures + iterators + blocks.
+ 79427 [lyle@us rs s] I will assume that you'll get answers from other readers of
| 79476 [vanevery@3D ] Interesting.  I hope it lasts as you get bigger... the niceness may only be
| 79479 [app1tam@up .] where the author switched to Java for speed reasons.
| + 79481 [Gavri_F@in o] Misleading statistics!! :-) Nobody really uses 'switched from'
| | 79485 [ben@th ng ag] I switched from Ruby to AMuchWorseLanguage
| | + 79489 [martindemell] I tried '"switched to" ruby -"switched to ruby"', but no luck.
| | + 79511 [vanevery@3D ] KISS.  Search for "switched" "Ruby".  Use your brain to figure out what
| |   79572 [michael_s_ca] readm=ak08gr%24sb3%241%40grapevine.wam.umd.edu&rnum=1&prev=/groups%3Fq%3Dg:t
| |   + 79605 [vanevery@3D ] Interesting!
| |   + 79647 [sean@cS Pl o] I whole-heartedly agree we should learn a new programming language every
| |     79682 [martindemell] Haskell was definitely worth the learning experience. Right now some of
| |     79685 [hal9000@hy e] Haskell is on my list of top 50 things to learn. Life is so short. :)
| |     79696 [Mark.Volkman] ...
| + 79486 [vjoel@PA H. ] Your search - "stopped using ruby" - did not match any documents.
+ 79428 [gtewalt@ea t] Im far from an expert at either language; in fact, Im still learning
| 79434 [curt@hi bs c] This is what I would call the "gestalt" of ruby!
+ 79444 [sean@cS Pl o] I may not be the best qualified to answer this, because I looked at
| + 79447 [STUCKNER@MU ] I didn't do the google search but I know of two people who have been on this
| | 79451 [ben@th ng ag] No, but it may be the be-all and end-all for scripting languages, at
| | 79460 [dave@3d x. o] 1. Native
| + 79450 [0bz63fz3m1qt] zero has left Ruby, exellent point!
| | 79493 [gsinclair@so] When you can prove it, I hope.  I know of a couple of counter-cases.
| + 79452 [roberto@RE O] To be fair, I know of two people (Ada fans) who stopped using Ruby and
| | 79525 [kdresner@cs ] I actually had to give up on a Ruby project because I couldn't get the Pgsql
| + 79472 [martindemell] Interesting google challenge, if nothing else :) Tried briefly, did come
| | 79475 [dcarrera@ma ] That's not true.  Go to www.perl.org and see.  I see nothing wrong or
| | 79484 [martindemell] To be perfectly honest, I see nothing wrong with perl.com either (a site
| + 79579 [gtewalt@ea t] Ironically, Google makes use of Python.
| | 79645 [sean@cS Pl o] I was just talking with someone last night about that.  My personal
| + 79700 [hanzspam@ya ] Okay. Suppose I propose a langauge called 'foo' to you, right here.
| | 79715 [sean@cS Pl o] That's precisely my point.  People don't switch languages that often;
| | 79761 [hanzspam@ya ] But if people haven't left Ruby, what can we gain by examining this
| | 79808 [sean@cS Pl o] I said we can ignore the opinions of these people.
| | 79928 [gsinclair@so] From http://www.c2.com/cgi/wiki?PythonVsRuby
| + 79772 [tpeters@in a] Not true, see http://www.ruby-talk.org/39308 . Compare with the authors
| | 79813 [sean@cS Pl o] "I was initially reluctant to leave Ruby and wanted to make sure we
| + 80017 [djkea2@mu ca] I came across someone today on the JudoScript list doing just that. If
|   + 80019 [martindemell] lines = words = chars = 0
|   | + 80024 [rvb@rv .d nd] yes yes ;) ... this obviously shows that he did not have a lot of
|   | | 80037 [martindemell] Except that it was designed from the ground up around java. From my
|   | + 80045 [bystr@ma .c ] <quote source="http://groups.yahoo.com/group/judoscript/message/295">
|   |   80059 [sabbyxtabby@] x = ARGF.read
|   |   + 80070 [wjl@ic ca er] charset="iso-8859-1"
|   |   | 80131 [michael_s_ca] I know there's a smiley there, but let's be fair; people don't
|   |   | + 80194 [wjl@ic ca er] charset="iso-8859-1"
|   |   | + 80227 [sabbyxtabby@] No effort was made to obfuscate.  Every effort was made to abbreviate.
|   |   |   80241 [michael.l.sc] I programmed in perl Until 93, when I switched to python.  Perl, as a language, was
|   |   |   80243 [djberge@qw s] Easy enough to do as is with a block, provided the package author simply
|   |   |   80247 [mgarriss@ea ] Holy cool batman!   *shivers with excitement
|   |   |   80249 [michael.l.sc] Thank you for the tip,
|   |   + 80083 [bystr@ma .c ] As somebody have already mentioned, you never stop learning something
|   + 80061 [denshimeiru-] What does stand there? I get a cyclic redirect.
|     80062 [THE-THING-IN] Copy-paste with selected headers.
|     + 80063 [dblack@su er] $ echo | ruby wc.rb
|     + 80064 [denshimeiru-] Thanks.
|     + 80068 [surrender_it] emh.. this seems too hard to me! won't this simpler one be equivalnt?
+ 79463 [billk@ct .c ] I understand Python has improved significantly since my
| 123148 [billk@ct .c ] I just wanted to apologize to everyone, and to Mr. van Rossum
+ 79519 [frido@q- of ] Well my way is a bit longer I first have looked at Perl but never