103225-103931

102938-104173 subjects 103335-110441

[ANN] celsoft.com/Battery 0.1.1
103225 [sean@ce so t] Battery is a unit testing framework for Ruby. It captures all standard error
+ 103236 [dblack@wo bl] You're implying, I believe, that Test::Unit runs the test methods in
| + 103238 [ jimm@io co ] Is that guaranteed by the API or should I not rely on it?
| | + 103248 [nathaniel@ta] It is guaranteed. Even if other orderings are added at some point in
| | | 103251 [jim@we ri hh] Even if it is guaranteed, I recommend not relying on it in the tests
| | | + 103253 [sean@ce so t] The order shouldn't matter, but it's better to have control over the order
| | | | 103255 [michael.camp] How is alphabetical order any better/worse than "the order they are
| | | | 103257 [sean@ce so t] Tests are stored as an array of blocks and are called in the order they appear
| | | + 103279 [cc1@ce .w st] Yes but I can think of a very simple reason someone might want to reorder there
| | |   103282 [gfb@to es ft] In your own tests you can always put
| | + 103249 [michael.camp] Beside your point a bit here, but you shouldn't rely on tests running
| + 103250 [sean@ce so t] When tests are run alphabetically, it makes it tough to run the same tests in
|   103267 [dblack@wo bl] I wasn't talking about the merits of one design or the other, just
|   103275 [sean@ce so t] Arbitrary meaning that, from a library USER'S viewpoint, the decision to order
|   103308 [dblack@wo bl] Have you checked the archives, or asked Nathaniel?  That might help
|   103329 [sean@ce so t] ar?bi?trar?y
|   + 103353 [dblack@wo bl] Maybe, maybe not -- but in either case, I was addressing your original
|   | 103366 [sean@ce so t] When you're given no choice, as far as you're concerned as a library user,
|   | + 103385 [jamesUNDERBA] I think David's point was that the order was decided after much
|   | | 103523 [sean@ce so t] This could never happen.
|   | + 103389 [jean_hugues_] I suspect that there is some misunderstanding here. That you would
|   |   103525 [sean@ce so t] Ordering tests alphabetically, to me, is arbitrary.  I can't say I really know
|   |   + 103533 [jamesUNDERBA] Picking a different word to avoid hurt feelings is probably not a good
|   |   | 103536 [sean@ce so t] Even Nathaniel himself admitted the decision to order tests alphabetically was
|   |   | 103541 [hal9000@hy e] I think I'm seeing the root of the disagreement (taking off my hacker
|   |   | 103546 [sean@ce so t] I wasn't referring to the decision so much as the order itself.  My initial
|   |   + 103538 [ahoward@no a] it seems that, at least in this instance, it was not __completely__ arbitrary
|   |   + 103539 [hal9000@hy e] Relax, this isn't a war.
|   |     + 103543 [sean@ce so t] No, because there is a solid reason for the order of the words in the
|   |     | + 103545 [Austin.Ziegl] This does not address the fact that it is a different claim than you
|   |     | | 103547 [sean@ce so t] What claim is that?  That the tests were run in a random order?  Nathaniel
|   |     | | 103548 [Austin.Ziegl] I'm not forcing it on anyone[1], but it isn't my opinion only. Just
|   |     | | 103552 [sean@ce so t] Look how many people wish they could order their tests.
|   |     | + 103635 [jean_hugues_] Hum... I had a google search on "dictionary arbitray". One
|   |     |   103717 [Austin.Ziegl] Not sure how I missed this earlier: this has nothing to do with the
|   |     |   + 103721 [sean@ce so t] My only concern is for myself.  I released celsoft.com/Battery and
|   |     |   | 103742 [Austin.Ziegl] I don't know what you're talking about. Yours is the first complaint
|   |     |   | 103744 [sean@ce so t] Great work, Ziegler.
|   |     |   | + 103745 [bg-rubytalk@] Dude, take this kind of crap off the public mailing list.  Please.
|   |     |   | | + 103746 [vjoel@PA H. ] Seconded. It's off topic and immature.
|   |     |   | | | 103750 [sean@ce so t] Why didn't you say this about the people participating in the
|   |     |   | | | 103767 [vjoel@PA H. ] Lots of people say lots of inappropriate things about each other all the
|   |     |   | | | + 103771 [sean@ce so t] It didn't "delete" here in ML, so it's here forever archived, as far as I
|   |     |   | | | + 103778 [billk@ct .c ] Indeed.  I had already acknowledged the inappropriateness of that
|   |     |   | | |   103782 [sean@ce so t] Indeed you did.
|   |     |   | | + 103749 [sean@ce so t] Oh, it's fine when personalized insults about the quality of my projects are
|   |     |   | |   + 103755 [bg-rubytalk@] I have been ignoring this thread for a long time, I just happened to
|   |     |   | |   + 103760 [hal9000@hy e] I think Ben meant you should BOTH (or ALL) take it offlist.
|   |     |   | |     103762 [sean@ce so t] When people post messages to me in private, I will reply in private.  It's a
|   |     |   | |     103779 [ljz@as as .c] ... etc. etc. etc. etc. ...
|   |     |   | |     103783 [sean@ce so t] Clearly not you.  You could have very easily sent this to me as a private
|   |     |   | |     103784 [dross@co e- ] Ok fine.. I didn't want to act like this but you foreced me.
|   |     |   | |     103787 [sean@ce so t] It's funny how people go out of their way to make someone look bad, but end up
|   |     |   | |     + 103788 [dross@co e- ] Oh thanks, that reply just shows how addicted and insane you are acting.
|   |     |   | |     | + 103790 [sean@ce so t] Why are you still posting on-list with this?  Afraid to have a one-on-one with
|   |     |   | |     | + 103796 [gsinclair@so] Please do not make comments like this while purporting to represent the
|   |     |   | |     + 103801 [nick@ac iv h] Kudo's to everyone on the enthusiasm and follow-through on this thread.
|   |     |   | + 103747 [lrz@gn me or] *Please* would you mind to continue this discussion in *private*
|   |     |   |   103751 [sean@ce so t] Did you see the self.promote.com/energizer thread?  Why didn't they send that
|   |     |   |   103752 [Austin.Ziegl] 1. Try http://rubyforge.org/projects/ruby-pdf -- there is real stuff
|   |     |   |   + 103753 [Austin.Ziegl] Wrong. I commented specifically on what I saw as shortcomings of
|   |     |   |   | 103758 [sean@ce so t] I do contribute, and don't count on me "chilling" with anyone who holds
|   |     |   |   | 103775 [jean_hugues_] <META>
|   |     |   |   | + 103776 [dross@co e- ] Okay, thanks for irritating the people of the Ruby world. Please keep all
|   |     |   |   | | 103781 [sean@ce so t] Why didn't you send this to me as private email?  Did it need to be posted
|   |     |   |   | + 103780 [sean@ce so t] You're another one who seems overly concerned with getting certain kinds of
|   |     |   |   |   103805 [jean_hugues_] No offense.
|   |     |   |   + 103754 [sean@ce so t] Time to go private, Ziegler.
|   |     |   |   + 103756 [bg-rubytalk@] Much as I think you have the right to defend yourself, please, stop.
|   |     |   + 103772 [gsinclair@so] I wouldn't worry about that point too much.  It's a pretty simple
|   |     |     103773 [sean@ce so t] Thank you for respecting my own approach.  I was beginning to feel as if no
|   |     + 103584 [gsinclair@so] No because that ordering makes sense to Sean.  Anything *else* would
|   |       103587 [sean@ce so t] Close, but not quite right.  It makes sense to most people, including me.
|   |       103593 [walker@le ha] Arbitrary does not mean 'bad,' 'random' or 'senseless.' - It literally means 'because I said so.'
|   |       103596 [sean@ce so t] You're taking the side of those who get spit on, I should warn you.
|   + 103412 [nathaniel@ta] Early in test/unit's life, test order was arbitrary (well, OK, they
|     + 103413 [jgb3@em il b] Forgive me if this has already been asked and answered, but what exactly
|     | + 103516 [Austin.Ziegl] This is a different claim than you made initially.
|     | | 103535 [sean@ce so t] I learned that tests were run alphabetically, but originally I thought they
|     | + 103532 [sean@ce so t] I don't think people think its a bad thing, people just don't like when people
|     |   103549 [gfb@to es ft] It is the worst case of over self-confidence and stubbornness I have
|     |   + 103553 [jamesUNDERBA] No no no.  Not random order; *arbitrary* order.
|     |   | 103557 [sean@ce so t] Arbitrary isn't an ordering method per se.  Alphabetic can be arbitrary, as
|     |   + 103555 [sean@ce so t] Meaning what, that Nathaniel didn't post saying he found some good ideas in my
|     |     103621 [nathaniel@ta] I personally am EXTRA glad that you took the initiative to go and code
|     |     103624 [sean@ce so t] I really couldn't care less.  People can use my stuff or not, it doesn't
|     + 103530 [sean@ce so t] Competition doing its job of making software better.  =)
+ 103551 [djberg96@ho ] <nasty emails snipped>

{OT] was Re: Switch to .ruby extension?
103231 [hal9000@hy e] True. But the best thing would have been to read a tutorial of some

any Boston Rubyists want to have breakfast? :-)
103237 [dblack@wo bl] I'm in Dedham, Mass., outside of Boston.  I'm leaving late morning or

Re: Switch to .ruby extension? [OT]
103239 [discord@ma .] heh :) I had a similar experience, coming from a Mac, with no command
103246 [mailing-list] I think I may be earning myself a reputation as a user-friendliness
+ 103252 [zdennis@mk e] Since the CLI is mostly used by developers, hard core users, wannabe geeks
| 103258 [mailing-list] As a matter of fact, I think that's an excellent idea. But, as I
| + 103261 [bg-rubytalk@] Ok, this is really not the area to discuss the pros and cons of generic
| | 103264 [mailing-list] Actually, Unix editors aren't different - they're the same as every
| | 103290 [lists@za a. ] Please, Unix editors like vi/vim and emacs _do_ evolve improve over time
| | 103317 [jamesUNDERBA] Ctrl-H
| | 103318 [michael.camp] "Bah!  Ctrl-H for replace?!  That's unintuitive and user-unfriendly.
| + 103262 [zdennis@mk e] I see where you are coming from, but I do not necessarily agree with you.
| + 103271 [discord@ma .] I just had to comment on one thing.
| | 103273 [mailing-list] I'm not talking about the command line per se, I'm talking about
| | 103278 [gfb@to es ft] You are right, all trollers talk about same thing. You are no exception.
| | 103281 [mailing-list] Oh, you've heard these complaints before? So maybe there's some merit in
| + 103302 [rasputnik@he] You wanted to know how to use a tool, and someone told you to read
| | 103371 [zdennis@mk e] Dick,
| | 103372 [mailing-list] I take credit for all the tom-foolery in this thread.
| + 103304 [martindemell] Just had to comment on this bit. vi isn't easy to *learn*; it's easy to
| + 103307 [segphault@sb] I get really tired of hearing people say something is bad just because
+ 103358 [mghallNO@SP ] You're right, of course.  However, I'd suggest you take the time to read
  + 103368 [mailing-list] I think Unix is my OS of choice for this very reason. I do most
  + 103571 [austin-mcdon] Hopefully such a thing will address concerns like this in the future.

uninitialized constant Magick in RMagick
103263 [piir@ea th i] I and using the Windows machines by necessity :~(
103322 [eule@sp ce c] I suggest you uninstall your gem and reinstall. This should put the size
103769 [piir@ea th i] I just uninstalled and reinstall the jam as you suggested above.  It
103931 [eule@sp ce c] It seems as though Todd's installation fails to load a shared object

assignment in conditional warning
103266 [one@no he e.] Why in the world is there a warning, *even with brackets*, for assignments
103314 [bob.news@gm ] "Rasputin" <one@nowhere.net> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
+ 103323 [ahoward@no a] IMHO the above fails apart when you are testing compound datastructures using
| + 103345 [bob.news@gm ] "Ara.T.Howard" <ahoward@noaa.gov> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
| + 103346 [vjoel@PA H. ] Actually, (3) is even worse that it looks here, because you have to test
+ 103420 [one@no he e.] Actually, I don't think(not sure about this though) that Ruby actually
  103573 [bob.news@gm ] "Rasputin" <one@nowhere.net> schrieb im Newsbeitrag

fltk on OS X working?
103268 [jim@fr ez .o] Does anyone have fltk 1.1.x or 1.2 bindings working with OS X?
103269 [mailinglists] Not for OS X but i have a working ruby-fltk for WinXP/Win2K. It comes
103274 [jim@fr ez .o] I have compiled 1.1.5rc1 and have downloaded ruby-fltk-0.9.0.
103276 [jim@fr ez .o] Looking at this further, extconf.rb checks the number of args
+ 103403 [timsuth@ih g] Try
| 103419 [jim@fr ez .o] g++ -I/opt/local/include -L/opt/local/lib flimage3.cc
+ 103423 [quixoticsyco] __________________________________

Packaging and license for a Windows distribution (was: Re: [ANN] EZExerb 2.0)
103270 [rich@li hi o] Thanks again for working with me - I really haven't written that much Ruby

RMagick && Pathname
103283 [cc1@ce .w st] I don't know who wide spread this is in RMagick, but isn't Pathname supposed to
103316 [cyclists@nc ] It's a deficiency in RMagick, which is checking explicitly for either a

Any way to get the calling method's binding?
103293 [gsinclair@so] Something I've wanted to do on a few occasions recently is to evaluate
+ 103294 [vjoel@PA H. ] ...
| 103295 [austin-mcdon] def trace (expr)
| 103296 [vjoel@PA H. ] def trace(&block)
| 103297 [austin-mcdon] Excellent; I had the right idea, but yours is much cleaner.
| + 103299 [cc1@ce .w st] Umm that's exactly what gavin was trying to avoid, explicitely passing the
| + 103300 [austin-mcdon] Right.  I'm out of it at the moment; got wrapped up in following the
+ 103312 [flgr@cc n. e] Regards,
  + 103313 [bob.news@gm ] "Florian Gross" <flgr@ccan.de> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
  | 103315 [flgr@cc n. e] Global trace_funcs are a *huge* performance bottle neck. That's why I'm
  | 103320 [bob.news@gm ] "Florian Gross" <flgr@ccan.de> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
  + 103393 [jean_hugues_] This is a very creative piece of work, congratulations !
    103410 [flgr@cc n. e] Thanks. :)

Need help with mod_ruby under Win32
103324 [ykloubakov@f] I know there are not many people on this mailing list who use my
103327 [eule@sp ce c] ~      #~ unless r.finfo.executable?
103350 [ykloubakov@f] Thanks, Kaspar.  I am not getting this error any more.
103360 [ykloubakov@f] After some debugging done, I found that Apache crashes on the
103376 [ykloubakov@f] I found the problem but I am not good with patches.

OpenSSL: patch
103328 [jgb3@em il b] ...
103427 [gotoyuzo@no ] Thanks a lot. Your patch seems a good solution. It will be
103447 [jgb3@em il b] OSSL_PKEY_BN macros. I discovered them later and then used them (in the
+ 103455 [discord@ma .] can't wait to see that :) I can think of several uses right off the top
| 103456 [jgb3@em il b] I'm glad I'm not the only one that wants this. It's been a pretty
| 103471 [surrender_it] weite your own server too? :))
| 103488 [jgb3@em il b] Ha ha. :) Yah, just let me whip out an SSH server while I'm at it. ;)
+ 103470 [gotoyuzo@no ] I did it. No need to re-post.
  103487 [jgb3@em il b] One other thing: I was advised off-list that the "crypt" method I added
  103503 [gotoyuzo@no ] No problem. ossl_cipher.c was rolled back.

undefine
103334 [snowzone5@ho] is there a way to undefine a variable?
103347 [bob.news@gm ] "tony summerfelt" <snowzone5@hotmail.com> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
103349 [DocBoobenste] I concur.
103359 [bob.news@gm ] "Claus Spitzer" <DocBoobenstein@gmail.com> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
103363 [DocBoobenste] well yes... It's just part of the procedural-->OO shift that everyone
103405 [bob.news@gm ] "Claus Spitzer" <DocBoobenstein@gmail.com> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
103438 [snowzone5@ho] undefine
+ 103448 [chr_mail@gm ] I am aware of this kind of functionality for
| 103483 [bob.news@gm ] "Christoph" <chr_mail@gmx.net> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
| 103583 [chr_mail@gm ] I did not advocate removing, a.k.a. undefining,
| 103634 [jean_hugues_] OTOH things should be undoable. If you believe so
| 103694 [snowzone5@ho] undefine
| + 103698 [rt@al m. pi ] Yes, but I think you may have missed something which (I think)
| + 103710 [discord@ma .] I think the whole point here is that it isn't Ruby-ish to rely on a
| | + 103725 [snowzone5@ho] i'm slowly learning the ruby way to do things...
| | + 103736 [jean_hugues_] def test(); p defined? x; x = "hello"; p defined? x; end
| | + 103740 [sean@ce so t] Actually, Matz could probably very easily expose variables as objects
| |   103765 [discord@ma .] Yes, I agree, it is possible that Matz could implement that. I think
| |   103770 [sean@ce so t] I looked at the BLOCK structure that is the C representation of the binding
| + 103763 [flori@ni e. ] In your code you used global variables, and they work different
|   103792 [snowzone5@ho] undefine
|   103807 [jean_hugues_] def test_1()
|   103815 [discord@ma .] that out... severe lapse of memory, I suppose.
+ 103465 [DocBoobenste] Again, this is where it's useful to consider the OO approach and think
| + 103481 [bob.news@gm ] "Claus Spitzer" <DocBoobenstein@gmail.com> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
| + 103550 [snowzone5@ho] undefine
|   103560 [michael.camp] Why is this?
|   103577 [snowzone5@ho] undefine
|   103578 [michael.camp] Well, you say you want it to no longer exist because you want it to no
|   + 103582 [Austin.Ziegl] Well, there's a problem with that. In Ruby, variables themselves are
|   | + 103588 [snowzone5@ho] undefine
|   | + 103636 [jean_hugues_] That variables are not objects is somehow an issue I believe.
|   |   103638 [jim@we ri hh] I don't see a big need for Variable objects, but some interesting
|   |   103735 [jean_hugues_] I am working on a RCR to have free/bound variables
|   + 103586 [snowzone5@ho] undefine
|     + 103590 [sean@ce so t] Don't check for defined, check for nil.  It's virtually the same thing, unless
|     + 103592 [rt@al m. pi ] Can't you just use "=nil" to achive the same thing?
|     | 103609 [snowzone5@ho] undefine
|     | 103613 [rt@al m. pi ] I'm aware what they do, but you can get the desired behavior
|     | 103689 [snowzone5@ho] undefine
|     + 103594 [discord@ma .] testing whether diff is defined won't work in ruby anyway. Any time you
|     | + 103597 [WBrown@is ft] Tony,
|     | | + 103614 [snowzone5@ho] undefine
|     | | | 103615 [rt@al m. pi ] He's probably wondering why your news reader keeps stripping
|     | | | 103690 [snowzone5@ho] as an OT aside: i'm not using a newsreader, i'm on the mailing list,
|     | | | + 103695 [rt@al m. pi ] Okay, I don't know alot about Windows email clients -- I was
|     | | | + 103696 [discord@ma .] Yes, they do.
|     | | + 103647 [ruby-lists@l] yeah. much nicer. shorter also.
|     | |   103699 [snowzone5@ho] undefine
|     | |   103700 [Austin.Ziegl] Okay. Here's a partial reimplementation. Some of it is
|     | |   + 103706 [Austin.Ziegl] foo.nil?
|     | |   | 103707 [WBrown@is ft] Tony,
|     | |   | 103724 [snowzone5@ho] well, no. i don't actually NEED it. it would be nice to have.
|     | |   + 103708 [snowzone5@ho] i must be doing something right, that' pretty close to  what i ended
|     | + 103598 [sean@ce so t] Oh!  Which brings to mind something really neat I figured out awhile ago.  If
|     | | 103643 [bob.news@gm ] "Sean O'Dell" <sean@celsoft.com> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
|     | + 103612 [snowzone5@ho] undefine
|     + 103633 [msparshatt@y] Here you check that @diff is defined after trying to access an element
|       103691 [snowzone5@ho] undefine
+ 103517 [bg-rubytalk@] I think the best way to get the behaviour you want is to use a hash.
  + 103519 [surrender_it] hey, accesing globals from a method is ugly, just use a singleton :)
  + 103554 [snowzone5@ho] undefine
    103641 [bob.news@gm ] "tony summerfelt" <snowzone5@hotmail.com> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
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