--- Nathaniel Talbott <nathaniel / talbott.ws> wrote:
> On Feb 2, 2004, at 13:20, Phil Tomson wrote:
> 
> > Nathaniel Talbott <nathaniel / talbott.ws> wrote in
> message 
> >
>
news:<013A62D9-5595-11D8-99FF-000A95CD7A8E / talbott.ws>...
> >> The next time they ask you about the bus, you're
> welcome to give them
> >> my email address :-)
> >
> > ;-)  Are you still in Oregon?
> 
> Nope... but I still have in-laws there. I'm
> finishing up my current 
> (Ruby) project, and am looking for new ones, and the
> top two places I'm 
> looking are North Carolina (my current location) and
> Oregon. Even if I 
> telecommute, it's great to get work that
> occasionally brings me close 
> to family. So if you have any Oregon work, we should
> talk :-)
> 
> 
> >> Seriously, I know so many _excellent_ programmers
> that would jump at
> >> the chance to get paid for Ruby coding. I don't
> think buses (or trains
> >> for that matter) are really a problem.

Anyone need some ruby work done in Texas from a bad
programmer? :)

> > I totally agree and I would add that any good
> programmer that has
> > experience in other languages and some OO
> background can pick up Ruby
> > and be productive in a few days.
> 
> The only qualifier I would make, from personal
> experience, is that a 
> good programmer coming to Ruby will still be missing
> two important 
> components after a few days - he won't be hooked up
> to the community, 
> and he won't be aware of the available libraries.
> Oh, and if he hasn't 
> used a language with closures, he'll miss a
> significant portion of 
> Ruby's power until they click with him. It sounds
> like a sales pitch, 
> but I would say that it is critical for a commercial
> project to at 
> least have a ruby expert on call, if not on the
> team. What's a Ruby 
> expert? Hard to quantify, but I'd say a minimum of
> one 
> publicly-available Ruby project, and one year of
> reading the ruby-talk 
> list.
> 
> 
> > I was talking about management
> > perceptions of the language.  We both would agree
> that these
> > perceptions are inaccurate, but they're still a
> barrier.
> 
> Perceptions are, indeed, tough. I was just talking
> to a friend (one of 
> those great programmers who would love to be doing
> Ruby), and he was 
> saying that the consulting company he works for has
> 12 potential 
> clients that don't care what technology is used to
> implement their 
> projects. So of course, the salesman is
> recommending... .NET!?!?!? The 
> salesman's justification is that he wants to use the
> best thing for his 
> clients, and his perception is that C# and .NET are
> the best. How do we 
> deal with that? I'm not sure, but I know that the
> more Ruby code that 
> gets laid down, publicly or privately, that's works
> well and meets 
> people's needs, the better it will get.
> 

I'm an M$ guy since about '97. Since ~2002  i've been
investigating alternatives to M$ - not because their
products suck but because of their practices. I like
ecmascript(javascript)  a lot and was seeking a
server-side version(i  was using jscript with asp,
which is quite nice, imo). There are a few but they
are either proprietery or dead. I also looked at
php(and used it quite a bit- pragmatic is not ALWAYS
good ;)), Zope, JSP,XANG, SPYCE...a few others. Then I
found ruby and it is better than I knew i needed.

...to my point, I think M$ stuff (in particular .Net)
is best of breed in many cases<me ducks>. If matz had
all the money in the world to throw at ruby it would
be best, i think. But if you go with M$  you pay for
it now and especially tommorrow - not too mention
suffering other monopolistic practices. So go with
.Net if you've plenty of bucks now - and plan to(have
$) in the future when you're forced to upgrade. Or use
ruby, which is immensely competent, open,
approachable, extenisble, cross-platform,  free and
cool.

Right now, i'm going with ruby. But frankly that has
bitten me because people see it on my resume and
go...huh? Which speaks to another recent post. Until
ruby gets mainstream, i'll be eating a lot of 
TopRaman.

Paul



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