Thought I'd switch the subject line to the subject at hand. Some summary observations on recent discussions.... The Mozilla stuff looks like it would involve C++ interface code, which tends to be more troublesome to support on many systems, relative to plain old C. (This is one of the drawbacks to wxWindows.) Mozilla's XPFE is still a work in progress. End-user documentation seems scarce. (I haven't done an exhaustive search however.) As yet, there is not a track record of successful use by Perl and Python--not that we should blindly follow them, but as a smaller community with fewer total resources at our disposal, we should think twice about being on the bleeding edge. It seems that many Ruby extension developers apparently don't like dealing with C++, meaning thinner support and backup resources if we went with things like Mozilla, wxWindows, or gtk--. GTK+ is pure C, and some substantial fraction of Ruby/GTK+ is *already* *done*. And there are already a couple of *books* on GTK+ programming. And there is a pretty nice open source GUI-based GUI builder available for it (i.e. Glade), unlike the one for wxWindows, which is proprietary. In addition to Linux, cross-platform support for GTK+ seems tolerably good on Windows, and pretty good on major Unix systems. (This condition will probably rapidly generalize to the new "UNIX-Mac"--if this hasn't already happened.) None of the GUI options will support as many platforms as Tk, so there will be some trade-off of platform range versus GUI capabilities versus existing scale of GUI developer community size. What would be best for some small percentage of Ruby users on relatively rare (%-wise) platforms could considerably disadvantage the great majority of Ruby users on the commonest platforms. I think Windows-only or Linux-only or Unix-only solutions are each out of the question, but the union of these is probably not too far from the sort of quasi-optimal trade-off region that would be the best for greatly boosting Ruby's suitability as a heavy hitter, GUI-wise (as measured by the maximum potential market for increased Ruby usage). So, for Dave's proposed purpose of closure-seeking, I (provisionally) think GTK+ would be the best choice for the time being (relative to all of the above considerations). I think that we also want something that (1) is already in fairly widespread use and that (2) already has published documentation (i.e. books, althought of course we will want to produce Ruby/* documentation for whatever choice we make). Because of the previous work that has already been done on GTK+, this is one of the least resource-intensive and thus fast-to-market GUI solutions as well. (I think that we will probably eventually want to support Mozilla a couple of years down the road, when it is much more mature, and when we have much more resources available to deal with it. However, I think GTK+ will remain very viable for many years to come, and will probably remain a richer GUI environment.) Conrad Schneiker (This note is unofficial and subject to improvement without notice.)