On 1/22/02 4:15 AM, "thespian" <entity / tzhau.cjb.net> wrote:

> 
>> This is just personal opinion but I'd hate to see the Ruby GUI API
>> standardize on anything C++ based. I've used a few C++ UI toolkits and,
>> while they all worked, they were just so un-Ruby. Part of the joy
>> of Ruby is
>> that you don't have to start subclassing to get anything done.
>> 
>> I'm very much a newbie here but the idea that you would use something as
>> dynamic as Ruby for the model and something as static as C++ for the UI is
>> just backwards. You can live with a static, strongly typed language in the
>> model: some would argue that it's an advantage there. Views really benefit
>> from dynamism and weak typing.
> 
> hi
> 
> i don't know if i understand correctly, but libraries like FOX and Tk were
> all written in a language other than ruby, but their ruby wrappers are well
> written in the dynamic ruby style. sort of. mostly. i hope.

Duh. Of course. I don't know why that wasn't obvious to me.

> the issue remains: windows users, in general, simply cannot take anything
> other than native components seriously. and i'm certain that mac and some
> other OS people will feel the same way. perhaps one can provide a standard
> layer, formally part of the language (designed properly) that supports
> native plugins.

I agree. I would add that I've heard complaints from Mac users about Java
apps looking *too* native. I think what they mean is that widgets look like
native widgets but behave differently, thereby breaking an implicit contract
with the user to behave the way that widget normally behaves. The attitude
is "I'm willing to experiment a bit with an unfamiliar widget to figure out
how it works but I can't forgive a widget that violates reasonable
expectations." I only bring this up because it's so much easier to get
native appearance than to get native behavior.

-- 
As an adolescent I aspired to lasting fame, I craved factual certainty, and
I thirsted for a meaningful vision of human life - so I became a scientist.
This is like becoming an archbishop so you can meet girls. -Matt Cartmill,
anthropology professor and author (1943- )