On 3/28/07, Mark T <paradisaeidae / gmail.com> wrote: > OpenQM is a multi-field database based on Pick/Universe/Everyone... > "OpenQM uses the post-relational model in which the First Law of > Normalisation is discarded, allowing multiple values such as a list of > products in an order to be stored together." This is complete and utter nonsense. "Post-relational" is a completely nonsensical term, and the understanding of the first law of normalisation is incorrect or incomplete or both to be able to say that. I wouldn't trust OpenQM for anything given this response you were given. The list of products in an order are *related* to the order; how you store those values *physically* is completely irrelevant to how you model that relationship. There's no such thing as "post-relational" with a theory of data that is even remotely comprehensible in any way. "Post-relational" is short for "I don't get relational theory, therefore, I'm going to try to sound like I know better than Codd." You don't. If I'm understanding the physical structure correctly, Oracle offers something similar; it's called a table column such that you can define a column in a table as an array or table to tightly tie the data together in a relationship. Interestingly, Oracle will often store the table column data *externally* to the container table -- that is, Oracle will still represent it as a traditional table/related-table model even though they're allowing the user to do stupid things with normalisation. > Q: When you put this against node-xml access, does xml imply it also > discards the First Law? > A: http://www.xml.com/pub/a/2002/11/13/normalizing.html XML as a data storage technique is no more than old-style hierarchical datastores returned to haunt us. (It does have a couple of techniques that IMO are mildly interesting, in that you can use XLink and references to get proper normalization, but vanilla XML is purely hierarchical.) -austin -- Austin Ziegler * halostatue / gmail.com * http://www.halostatue.ca/ * austin / halostatue.ca * http://www.halostatue.ca/feed/ * austin / zieglers.ca