On Sun, 30 Jan 2005, Trans wrote:

> So then you end up writing even crappier programs anyway b/c you don't
> really get the model the way it ought to be. So what's the point? Worse
> you don't even realize it till you go to add the last little feature
> and realize it screws the whole model up, and the only way to get it in
> there is to write a god aweful hack.

And how is it terribly different in a program that carefully avoid using
any OOP feature (except for the fact that, by choice, you don't use any
OOP constructs to simplify the system, or just paraphrase your way into
equivalent but different-looking concepts) ?

> And how do you know everything fits well in an OOP model anyway?

You don't need to know that, just need to be comfortable enough with the
model, and make sure the model serves well its present requirements, and
if possible, its near-future requirements.

> Okay, I'll buy that explination I guess. OOP principles certainly have
> relavence. I'm not totally knocking them mind you. I simply think we
> haven't really seen them for what they are fully, which has created an
> over exuberhance for all things OOP and also set up some artifical
> barriers we must now contend.

Well, I say that alot of OOP code is crappy, and OOP is usually not
properly taught, because OOP is a new norm and some people have been too
enthusiastic and _naý×e_ about it. Worst offender is Java.

> Oh I'd probably Logo in a heart beat if ther were any _really good_
> implementations. It's basically just  slightly simplified-syntax lisp.

Funny, I thought it was a complexified-syntax lisp, but less powerful.

> And consider BASIC. Who would have ever thought BASIC would become a
> premier OOP langage? VB.net has the whole OOP thing going on now --in
> some ways even more so than Ruby.

I didn't know VB.NET was BASIC... I thought it was just C# but with an
alternate horrendous sin-tax designed to appeal to sixties nostalgics.

_____________________________________________________________________
Mathieu Bouchard -=- MontrñÂl QC Canada -=- http://artengine.ca/matju